The Noodle Curtain

She’s not your girlfriend

Life in Thailand can be one long, glorious illusion if you have a taste for the night life. You can live with that if you have a firm mind and a lock on your emotions.

With your emotions and expectations in check, you must treat the girls with respect and fairness, for they do a job that will earn them money to send back home to their impoverished families. Both sides win. It's a thankless, socially frowned-upon  but necesary component of Thai society.

One can meet girls from all walks of life, of course, but most of those girls your humble blogging servant met were working bars, shops and restaurants, and most originated from Isaan, the poorest part of Thailand. The following compilation is based on  numerous personal experiences  during my first lengthy plunge into Bangkok life. I can't blame anyone but myself for any faulty judgement over the last five months.

So let the lessons begin! There you are in Thailand. Let's say you  meet someone "unlike any girl back home." She's very attractive, friendly, happy, spirited, eager to please, flexible, easy-going, quick with a kind gesture, focuses on your happiness, and has myriad other desirable characteristics. Not the least of which  can be the grace of her existence under family pressures. (Note the clever introduction of a subject for a forthcoming post.)

After a few outings and dates, you are weighing whether to ask her to be your girlfriend. In fact, she eventually asks you if you want to have a GF.

But you met her in a bar! Girls entering the bar business learn how to act. They learn to do things that make you feel better, having learned from their "sisters" in the bar. They, in fact, become Academy Award actresses.

Many foreign commentators in Thailand, resident expats and regular visitors to the Kingdom say that  Thai girls who make their way into the bar business  go through a change in personality that comes to dominate their day to day lives. What she becomes embodies the illusion of the Girl Friend Experience (GFE).

So it is with embarrassment and (hopefully) catharsis that I shower upon you my experiences, such that they might  help you determine whether your special bar girl can change into a "real girlfriend" and maybe even become a good wife. Here are more than a dozen Red Flag scenarios -- Red Flag means "run away" -- to learn from as you date your new Thai girlfriend and introduce her to your close friends:

• She often looks over your shoulder as she senses a foreigner walking into view. She’s not your girlfriend.
• She has the eerie ability to hear  mobile phone calls and messages, even when deep in her purse on the table. She frequently leaves your company to answer calls. She's not your girlfriend.
• She always runs out of mobile phone credits. She’s not your girlfriend.
• She goes out in daytime with full makeup and enough dressed-to-kill magic for a week of nights. She's not your girlfriend.
• If she's one and a half hours late, she's already been drinking. If she's one and a half hours early, she's already been drinking. She's not your girlfriend.
• She likes Soi Cowboy not because she dreams of a go-go dance career, but because she can drink all night. She's not your girlfriend.
• She orders drinks for her "friends" and puts them on your bill. She's not your girlfriend.
• She would rather party with her "sister" and drink till dawn than go home with you (perhaps showing good taste!). She's not your girlfriend.
• She passes out when you get her home. She's not your girlfriend.
• She slips from her chair and mounts your lap in front of your closest friends. Alternative scenario: she straddles you face to face. Either way, your friends are impressed. She's not your girlfriend.
• She goes to the toilet and doesn't reappear for some time. When you retrieve her, she's talking with some guy. Or she's spent the time puking in the toilet. She's not your girlfriend.
• She's been to Indi, Bali and Singapore and you haven't. She's not your girlfriend.
• In a quiet moment after some bedroom exercises, she asks if you will marry her. Next day she doesn't remember. She's not your girlfriend.
• Your foreigner buddies and Thai friends see Red Flags and tell you to be careful. You, meanwhile, can't even spell "red." She's not your girlfriend.
• And the one thing that is a guarantee that she's not your girlfriend: She goes out with her "friends" and "sisters" to the bars of Patpong, Cowboy, Nana, Soi 33, Asok Corner and Soi 22 beer bars. She's a bar girl. She's everybody's girlfriend.

If you're reading this in one of those bars,  don't expect to find a girlfriend.

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Written by Siam Rick and edited by Khun Miken.

Wise advice on relationships with Thai bar girls

 

The most striking thing to me about Thai bar girls is how genuinely nice many are. Don’t know whether it’s just dumb luck that I’ve met many polite, courteous, thoughtful, kind, generous ones. 

There have been few really outrageous ones, the kind that contribute to the sterotypes that "all bar girls"  are  ripoff artists, thieves,  cold hearted, poor  performers, mercenary and show utter disinterest in and even outright disgust for a customer (some deservedly so).

Yet, foreigners frequently meet and marry bar girls. I’ll note only one thing (oft repeated in Southeast Asia): you can take the girl out of the bar, but you can’t take the bar out of the girl. Or can you? There are success stories despite the odds against.

But let’s not jump to marriage yet! Let's start off slowly with the relationship.

A good friend, Paul Spurrier, speaks pretty good Thai. It’s probably a natural result of living in Thailand for most of the last 11 years. Oh, and studying his ass off.

He’s in the entertainment business, and has directed, produced and distributed a well received film in Thai called P,  [Wikipedia film entry, Thai film journal entry, official film site]  which is the English phonetical translation from the Thai, ผี for “ghost.”

Paul [Wikipedia entry on Paul Spurrier]  was also director of photography for a Thai language TV series and an epic historical serial on the founding of the Thai nation. Pretty heady stuff for a foreigner to achieve.

You might say he knows a thing or two about the culture and the language and can shift into Thai at the drop of a “WELCOME!” from a Thai bar girl’s lips.

During his expat existence,  there were frequent visits to the Bangkok bar districts. Because of his Thai language proficiency, he could unearth a side of Thai bar girls’ lives unknown by the typical punter or tourist.

It is with not a little sympathy to the girls that Paul offers his advice on foreigner relationships with Thai bar girls, which he had written about a  year ago. It contains many grains of truth. Having  just reread it recently, I asked his permission to republish it:

• Don't risk any more than you are prepared to lose -- not only financially, but emotionally.
• If you have expectations, she will disappoint you. If you have none, she will constantly surprise you.
• Accept that you probably have never been as poor as she has, and that you can never really understand how that affects someone.
• Understand that due to everything she has been through, in the West she would almost certainly qualify for free psychotherapy -- and she may need it.
• Understand that she probably will never love you as much as her parents, and that she will always choose them over you, if made to decide.
• If you dump her, your life won't change that much. Hers will change utterly.
• Her jealousy may be a nuisance to you, but it is a greater burden to her.
• If you want her to love you for more than just your money, you have to be able to offer more than just money.
• If it doesn't work and you split up, it doesn't mean the relationship was a failure -- it was just a temporary success..
• Ignore all advice about dating bar girls.

Advice by Paul Spurrier (Page top photo by Paul Spurrier)
who is on Facebook and has his own web page.

Intro by Siam Rick.

UPDATE: Paul recently completed an assignment to  photograph all the dancers at Long Gun and Rawhide go-go bars on Soi Cowboy, Bangkok and revise their websites. The sites have just re-opened. I'm sure you will appreciate the quality work. Here are links to Rawhide Lounge and Bar  and Long Gun Bar. 

 

Trouble in Thailand: bugs, coffee beans, language and women

Had more freedom  to roam the web this past week and came across the darnedest things, like features on the edible bug industry in Thailand and Cambodia (this is going to get me one and maybe two  more readers!),  how Thailand is getting into the coffee business (more farmers to grow quality beans), a blog report on Thai nicknames (extensive and “inventive”) and another one on Thai provincial names (Abbreviations ‘R’ Us), and finally, a web item that aims to clear up some ideas on Thai women’s taste in men (the following statements are the opinions of the writer and do not reflect those of this station, er, blogger ). 

If you have a taste for bugs, raw, whole or fried, find out about how the edible bug industry works in Thailand. Just leg it to the Bangkok Post for a  thorough and crunchy feature. Surprises?  Most of them come from Cambodia, live ones preferred. It’s good to know, I think, that dead bugs are frowned upon in the big Talat (market) Rong Kluea  in Sa Kaeo province. It’s said to be the biggest insect market in Thailand. Another surprise: giant water bugs are said to be getting very expensive now and people are downsizing.  Me, I prefer identifiable food, as displayed in the picture.

If you have a taste for  tarantulas, then skitter on down to the photo blog Leo Laksi's Bangkok and Back and feast your eyes on those hairy legged web spinners -- not to be confused with any bloggers I know. Yes, when fried, they taste like chicken. Okay, just kidding.

If your taste is more ordinary, like mine, you’ll brim with nervous anticipation as you crack open the SEA Globe web portal and read about the mighty coffee bean trade in, well, Southeast Asia. Most of the growth in the south of Thailand is of the robusta variety, which is cheaper. But, due to an opium crop replacement program in the  north, Thai producers are being encouraged to grow  quality arabica beans in the hillier north. But the variety takes more work and there's a risk of the produce being contaminated by cheap imports.

If by any chance you’ve lost your appetite, you can read all about Thai nicknames. Boonsong Somboon's Thailand Photos gives us hundreds with English explanations. Bonus! He provides interesting alternative and inventive nicknames. A favourite Thai nickname of mine is Beer. It’s a fascinating blog overall for he puts up a new picture regularly, explains what’s going on, which leads him to a Thai language tip. He regularly makes up “new” English words and My Buddha, he has me buying the new word, because he’s so convincing. Informative and entertaining.

If you have a secret desire to explore more of Thailand but don’t dare because you can’t read the signs, the esoteric but fascinating blog  Changwat,  Amphoe, Tambon (province, district, subdistrict) has all the provinces listed in English and Thai scripts, including the abbreviations and postal code. Perfect if you forgot your Lonely Planet back in Sudbury (Canadian joke, akin to Fargo, or Manchester  -- I just made this up!)

If you fancy Thai girls, er, women, Thai female blogger Kaewmala has charted in detail the types (classes) of women who may or may not be seeking foreign husbands. (I wonder where martial arts action star Jija Yanin, inset image,  would fit in?)  Actually Kaewmala's info applies to all seekers and seekees. Don’t be shy, just visit ThaiWomanTalks. You’ll find lots of unrelated material, too, all well written and insightful.
LINKS:

• Everything you wanted to know about eating bugs in Thailand
• Everything you wanted to know about eating tarantulas in Cambodia
• SEA Globe feature on coffee beans in Thailand:
• The (almost) complete list of Thai nicknames:
• All the abbreviations in Thai and English for 76 Thai provinces:
• Thaiwomantalks.com summary chart on Thai women types

Looking for Lao in all the wrong places

Been bouncing around the net this weekend. I usually don’t stray from my appointed rounds but needed to shake the cobwebs off. In doing so, I came across some interesting sites offering news, propaganda, advertising, esoterica and sex (DOWN boys! -- look at the screen capture above).

I haven’t found much on Laos, so I decided to look harder. First, there’s not much Lao info even at Thaivisa.com in the Southeast Asia Forum. The main source there has moved to Singapore. But he still keeps in touch, as only a man with a Lao wife would have to.

Another big expat site, Teak Door, has only two pages  of threads on Laos from the perspective of visa runners from Thailand.

When I was visiting Vientiane in January, I liked to read the Vientiane Times newspaper. There are two of them on the web though. The Vientiane Times (dot com site),  apparently beginning in late 1997, is an aggregator of news from newspapers, news agencies, propaganda machines and state communications departments. The Vientiane Times (.org.la domain)   creates most of its own articles, often focusing on government and community activities. So it reads a bit like a government handout sheet. Then again, being in Laos, the paper, operated by a foreigner, has to tread a fine line with the authorities.  The latter is the better one for local Lao news and is very up to date. But, if you don’t read the stuff fresh off the “presses,” the articles disappear behind a paywall, a very expensive paywall. Might be worth it but its only method of subscription is a wire transfer and they are expensive and complex. (In Canada, recent money laundering prevention regulations mean I have to appear personally at the bank to arrange the transfer.)  Two “expensives” make me feel lazy. 

A real disappointment is finding an intriguing URL with Laos in it and finding it’s just a tour and hotel site. So many of these cheats. Also came across some private blogs that hadn’t been updated for months or had only just been added to within six or eight months or year’s gap.

However, there’s one (partial) exception, Travel to Laos Tips. It has some pretty good info. The operator, however, doesn’t make it easy to find out who created it (I did find one reader comment with an answer by Mapanoy, who appears to be the creator of this one, as well as the blog How to Lose 50 Pounds. Hmmm.) Nor does the site provide visible article dates (although the URLs contain year/month dates). In a nutshell, it seems like the site had a very good start but has pretty much been abandoned (no answers to six-month-old reader queries and nothing’s been posted since October 2009). A shame.

A change of countries now . . .

I kid you not, there’s an English language blog on Thai governmental administrative regions. It’s thorough, detailed, up to date and full of esoteric statistics and administrative orders. When I saw a link for Changwat, Amphoe, Tambon, I raced there to see what intrigue may lie in wait. I imagined a merry soap opera romp following the hijinks between first-level administrative officers and the village headman’s daughter. And who’s paying off whom.  Uh, not so much!  Instead, I spent almost an hour reading about “Wrong Tambon numbers in preliminary census 2000 reports;”  “National symbols of Thailand;”  “Muban administration modeled after British colonial model;” “Subdistrict name romanization.”  Talk about esoteric. It’s an impressive piece of work.

Again from the "I kid you not" department is a fresh blog called Sextalk by a Thai woman writing in English -- at a level that would shame many (so-called) native English posters on a certain large expat forum. Her focuses are Thai language,  romance and foreigner-Thai relationships -- and she also answers readers' questions. Rather than rhyming off compliments on her observations and entertaining writing style, read this from her About page: "Before you get any wrong idea, no, I’m not offering any type of erotic services, so you may put away that credit card now." Yes, she has a keen wit. too. She has also written a book by the same name, which is available on her website and is reviewed in detail here at Women Learning Thai. The site appears to be just over a year old, going by the date of her introductory page. By the way, she's an avid and thoughtful commenter (nickname, kaewmala) on some Thailand blogs such as you'll find in my sidebar below right, Favourite Asia Sites, in particular, Women Learning Thai. (Whether you’re a beginner or advanced Thai speaker, I can’t think of a better resource for learning materials, spiced with cultural features and interviews with fascinating people who tell about their paths to Thai language education.)

I’m always happy to indulge myself by reading  really good blog writing. If the subject also happens be Thailand or Southeast Asia, even better. And that’s what I found following a link at Women Learning Thai.     A gentleman who signed a comment DrWill caught my attention. His site, simply called Religion, Sex and Politics, I almost didn’t bother reading once I saw the title. I dove in anyway and would say it is well worth the visit for his clean and straightforward writing style. His analysis of the Red Shirt protest over the past year  might give you a different  perspective.  

It was at  The Thai Report  that I found Changwat, Amphoe, Tambon. The Thai Report collected links to the news of the day and it became really handy. Notice I said everything in the past tense.  In a recent email exchange with the site owner, he said the site was growing rather slowly.  Next thing I knew he had posted an announcement that he didn’t have time to keep it updated, but left up many good links to news sites, news blogs and cultural and Thai life blogs.   A shame really. The Thai Report was not a fancy site but who needs fancy, frankly, as long as it’s simple to load and easy to navigate.

Canadian boys need to toughen up

It sounds rather harsh but I’m telling you this for your own protection: protection of self and protection of cash and other valuables.

[Photo note: Smiles everywhere and so there should be because everyone's having fun. This was taken in Chiang Mai several years ago. Photos just used to dress up this long, long post. You'll thank me for it later!]

One of the most amazing things about Thailand, for example, is the abundance of beautiful women,  and available women. There’s so many of them but particularly in Bangkok and some of the hot tourist destinations, such as the southern islands of Krabi, Phuket, Samui, Chang, plus such cities as Udon Thani and Chiang Mai. 

A fresh, young fellow from Vancouver or Montreal or Winnipeg or Halifax arrives in Thailand and can’t believe his  luck or his eyes.  Soon our Canadian newbie discovers he’s catching the eye of not a few young ladies. Older ones, too.  In the squares, the high-end malls, the main streets, the markets, the bars, even the online dating sites. Good for the ego. But stop!

You may have noticed I’m focusing on women. Frankly,  you’re going to have the most interactions with women. Whether bars, shops, markets or public transportation, women seem to populate the service industry to an extraodinarily high degree and fill the streets.

What I’m going to say though applies very much more to the people you will meet in the Thailand tourist centres and districts. This applies to just about any Southeast Asian country that's become a tourist magnet. Remember, too, that  you will be in a very poor country where people try to scratch out a living and if that means trying to make a baht from tourists, then so be it.

So let’s get down to some tips to avoid a very deep abyss. Below that I’ve included summaries and URL references to several stories of Canadians -- let's face it, they're all men -- who have tasted the bitterest lessons:

Do not fall in love: You’re only in Thailand for a few weeks. You do not understand the culture, you do not understand Thai girls. You do not understand the laws.  You’re in a very hot, exotic, sensual tropical paradise. Far from home. Nothing is what it seems. At all. On the surface, most things seem normal to western eyes, but you are gravely misreading the entire situation. First, get educated,  which means you will get  burned a bit. I have some small burn scars. Not fatal, however. But you’ll need to conduct your research over several visits.

Yes, Thai girls make wonderful companions, they’re very beautiful, sensuous, and frankly make wonderful wives, from what I’ve read  But you don’t know anything about the girl you just met, or her condition. For example,   more experienced and talented girls know exactly what to tell a foreigner to gain sympathy and that love connection.  Ultimately, it’s all about the money for them. Brand that into your brain. I’m talking here about the players who can come from any level of society, although a significant proportion of players come from the poorest region, called Isaan,  a group of 13 provinces in the northeast of Thailand. Why? Because playing foreigners in the romance game is one way of gaining a huge amount of cash for little effort, in the shortest amount of time. Sometimes multiple streams of cash for foreigners dumb enough to send money from afar. See below.

Do not ignore red flags: In Thailand,  you will come across all extremes of people. I know, I know, you’ve heard that it's the Land of Smiles. It’s largely true. I’ve met some wonderful Thai people who went out of their way to help me in so many ways, big and small. (See link below to a previous post.) That’s been the majority of my experiences there.

But you have to be aware those smiles  can hide many things. They can distract you from some important  messages. Watch the body language, the tone of voice, the overall demeanour, the reflections in the nearby mirror or store window, the reactions  on the face of nearby Thais behind the counter or sitting on a stool at a food vendor, the walk down the shop aisle, the touch of a girlfriend and yes, the exchange of smiles between Thais is like a secret foreign language.

I’m not saying you have to analyze every moment and distille the messages to an essence -- just don't ignore the messages from the faint, sometimes, pulsing red flags that start to invade your consciousness:

'She seems to be calculating our shopping trip rather than enjoying the moment."

"At the  night market shop, she was testing me to see if I’d buy her that more expensive  Buddha medallion.

"Last night she seemed to rush through the meal.

"When we got home her ‘friend’ called. 

"This morning she didn’t answer her mobile.

"She said a couple of times she likes to travel.

"Lately she’s been asking me questions about back home. ‘Where do I live?’ ‘Do you have a car?’ ‘What do you do?’

You will be tested. She will test you to see how far she can manipulate you for whatever agenda she has cooked up in her mind. If you keep giving time and money and gifts, they won't be enough. You'll find you have to keep upping your level of generosity. Sometimes it seems, by her reactions, you can't give enough. You should have jumped the train long before this.

My reaction? Run. Don’t look back! Change your mobile phone number! Maybe even your hotel. You are being set up for a short-term or long term function, whose abbreviation is ATM.

Do not give money: Would you give money to a complete stranger back home? Highly unlikely. So why do it in Thailand. Have a response to a request for financial help already prepared in your head. “I won’t receive any money for a while so I can’t.” Don’t be exact about when or how much. Just keep in mind: Never. If that deflates the asker, good! The problem will likely go away soon and you’ll be better off for it. So if you are asked directly for money, you are being set up. See above, Run!

Do not send money: If you leave on good terms and feel you want to help out her impoverished family, Do Not! You’ve only met this person a week or two ago and you’re thinking of wiring her money?  If she convinced you, how do you know she hasn’t hooked two or three or four other guys? She may be getting 20,000 to 50,000 baht a month. In Thailand, that’s a lot of money considering a store clerk earns 4000 or 5000 baht a month. If she asks, just point blank say you will not. She disrespected you and herself by asking. That says enough about her character right there. When you leave, make it a positive goodbye, as in, hope to see you next time, etc. But stop there. I repeat: Do Not Send Money. Ever.

Do not be a pussy: Here’s where I’m going to be insensitive to my fellow Canadians. You’re too damned nice. It’s probably the same back home but you let women walk all over you. Since I live in Toronto (soon to be past tense . . .), I’ll refer to its citizens only . It’s full of very cool dudes, a lot of nice guys, easy going, good demeanours, generous, good-hearted guys. But you’ve got too much of one thing going for you. You need to rediscover your tougher male hide. And then find the balance.

I have two extreme examples to tell you about, how two Canadian guys in Thailand were victimized. As well, a well known Bangkok columnist and former Canadian cop express their shock at  the ease with which Canadian men become victims. All recent stories.

The first is a very, very sad story. From all media and online reports, Dale Henry from  Calgary was just a super guy, kind and generous to a fault.  He worked the oil rigs and always went back to his Thai wife and her village every chance he got. He loved her. He lavished cash and gifts on her and the family. He took care of her in his will and made her the beneficiary of his company’s life insurance coverage. One day police found him shot dead. His wife had hired a hitman who did the deed while Dale Henry slept in bed. All of this information is in the Thai public records. The perpetrators were caught, charged and convicted, which in and of itself is surprising blessing. Meanwhile, the wife and co-conspirators had drained Dale Henry’s bank accounts.

The second is the story of a Canadian man who writes under the nickname of Tom on the  popular website, Stickman’s Bangkok. Tom reveals the entire  sordid tale, leaving no self-incriminating moments out. He was sucked dry again and again -- by the same girl -- in a series of abominable lies and deceptions. Each time he fell for her claims of innocence and love. It’s a really long story but I couldn’t stop reading it and then I felt like vomiting. The guy went so deep I’m amazed he could pulled himself out after about the seventh calamity. He writes: “I could have kept this story to myself, but that would be a waste of a good lesson for others.”

Stickman has received so many reports of Canadians falling victim to players that he moved to ask several times, what is wrong with Canadians?  Stickman is a nom de plum for a 40-ish New Zealander married to a Thai woman. He has about a dozen years of experience in Thailand and consequently speaks almost fluent Thai. He writes at the end of a reader submission, Aug. 21, 2009:

“There is something I have to say here and please to all you Canadians, don't take offence.  I have found the Canadians to be a great bunch, friendly and for the most part they have given me a great impression of their country to the point it is a place I'd like to visit.  But man oh man, when you read these "Thai girl did me wrong" stories it is invariably the Canadians who get hit hardest.  Countless times it is the poor Canadian.  I have no idea why that is, but there is a definite trend!”

Last, just recently, a Canadian policeman, retired after 37 years, submitted an article to Stickman signing it John the Cop.  It starts:  “When Canadian men go to Thailand, for some reason they become the victims of the most ridiculous scams.”

In a nutshell, smile, be kind, easy-going,  but there's no need to be  an ass or  set any traps. Let the evidence come to you. It inevitably will. Red flags? Then bail!

I rest my case.

LINKS:

• Earlier post: Wonderful experience with Thai people
• Original thread about death of Dale Henry on Thaivisa.com
• Thread on court verdict  in Dale Henry case on Thaivisa.com
• Queen of Lies and Deception by Canadian victim Tom at Stickman
• Canadian policeman's view at Stickman

Female temptations in west bring predictable endings

There’s a big bar in Toronto’s east end. I avoided it for a long time because it’s big and noisy. But it’s also fun and it’s where I befriended a young waitress there.  Or more accurately, she befriended me.

When I came back to Canada in April 2009 from seven months in Southeast Asia, you can imagine the culture shock. You lads and ladies living in Thailand, I know, are sitting there shaking your heads knowingly. And probably wondered whether I needed my head examined for returning home. There’s this common activity in the west called work. Good, paid work. Anyway, you know the rest.

I was okay for the first couple of months, kind of languishing in the cooler temps and comfortable familiarity of home. Hey, I can read ALL the signs! WooHoo! I can actually talk with a store owner. The prices are fixed (yeah, fixed waaaaay too high . . . ).  Service at retailers is okay, but I have limited experience interacting with store clerks because I dislike shopping. Intensely. 

I have a lot of customer experience in bars, however. One place I had been going to was just turning into the pits. Two fellow travellers to Southeast Asia and I often met there. We  have honed and polished our reactions to poor service and wrong orders in a far off place that doesn’t reward good service. We can put up with anything. Except we met our limit. Waitress arrives at table, glances at us and looks away, possibly because she’s seen something more interesting on the sidewalk, like a garbage truck, other than us paying/tipping customers.  She takes the order and doesn’t say a thing. She  doesn’t reappear for 10 minutes. She’s chatting with a girlfriend  By the way, this blonde cutie  is a knockout. If there’s a beauty pageant for small packages, she’d be a top-fiver.

After several episodes of this plus some other pretty dismissive, disrespectful behaviour, we’d had enough. Not to mention a growing trend toward short pours. In this one place anyway.

Now, where to go? Too many places have corporate entities controlling them and the service is based on pattern repetition. All the staff say the same thing when you enter, when you order, when you get the drink, when you pay up and when you leave. Gag inducing. Like when you go to a Starbucks in Bangkok. The gal or guy making the cafe mocha says the same thing  the gal or guy says in Toronto or New York or San Francisco or London. “How’s your day?” “What are you doing today?” Or something very similar. Buffalo cakes!

 I started going to the loud, raucous neighbourhood place. Often. There were some pretty nice  girls working there and one seemed to take a liking to me. She started occasionally sitting with me when it wasn’t busy.

This went on for several months. Needless to say, that made it a very pleasurable place to go.  

Now I’m starting to grow fonder of my hometown. Finally found  a place where a 50-something guy isn’t someone to avoid, never mind talk to. The girls working there are extremely nice and always have a hello and smile. Good for the soul. Oh no, I’m starting to weaken. Yes, My Blonde Friend  is starting to wear away my cynicism and penetrate a manner that might be described as "occupied."

For some time, I remained neutral, shall we say. Some of that could be, while she would always stop off and chat a moment, and sit with me, even do up her cutlery tasks, she never asked me how I was or what I was doing or what I did. She was happy to talk about herself.  I started to be a little disappointed. Then one evening she told me about writing something on her specialty, for which she was just awarded her  master’s degree.  I offered to read it for her since editing is my profession. She was keen to let me see it.

On Halloween, the place was packed. She was in the bar with her friends. I bought them a round of drinks. My Blonde Friend bought me one in return. She came over and put her arms around me and posed for a picture taken by a friend. She wanted a copy and said I would, only maybe the following week when . . . and she filled in my words . . . she’d be sober. We had a laugh. She was thoroughly great company.

A few nights later and it’s back to the bar on a Monday, as I usually do. I sat off in a corner, working on some notes for a piece I was planning. Eventually, I signalled her over and said I had the picture she wanted. When I came in she was sweet and apologized for being so hammered on Halloween. What? Nothing to apologize for.

Long conversation cut short, I asked: “Do you want me to send the picture?”

She starts walking away. “What do I need a picture of me for?”

Dismissed. No graceful exit. Like a simple thanks for the offer.

 In summary, MBF reminds me of a type: a gal who sits on the side of a swimming pool, still dressed with her swim suit on underneath. She dangles her feet in the water but never goes in. It’s a type that is very common in the west. 

I have to admit  I actually had moments when I asked myself, “Is life so bad here I couldn’t find some happiness if someone liked me enough?”   After the MBF episode,  I hardly needed another reminder about the  poor state of in male-female relations in the west. I think the answer is a resounding “no.” Never mind the state of civility and graciousness.

All in all, I still like her and she's a very nice person.

But I am really looking forward to returning to Thailand in five weeks!

[Original item edited because it was too long and boring.]

Asian dating sites, part 3: Looking in Thailand

There are thousands of photos and profiles of girls on the Asian dating sites. Take an  example of a typical Thailand profile. She’s pretty, she’s young, about 28, she’s available. She lives in a province of Isaan, Thailand. She speaks “some” English. She works in a hair salon. She’s looking for a suitor in the 40-55 age range. You are admiring her pictures and are considering clicking that icon that says “Show Your Interest” in the hopes of exchanging messages and maybe even making a date.

You look on the four photos, blinded by her more than average  looks, and you suddenly realize that’s a hotel bed in the room. Huh? Other pictures start to look very suspicious. A girl is casually  lying on a hotel bed. Or standing near the open door of a hotel toilet, obvious from the hotel style shampoo and soap hanging about. Or sitting in the posh lobby of a hotel. Or sitting at a bar table with foreign males all around and wearing a low-cut top and hip-baring jeans. Or posing in a photo that's been cropped in half to remove the BF, past (or present) tense. Or leaning on the railing of a fast motorboat with the Mediterranean in the background. Or sitting in the seat of a European sports sedan with a distinctly European architecture dressing the background. Or sitting on a white leather sofa in an Italian villa. Or wearing a beautiful designer blouse, with jewelry decorating the neck and cleavage, as well as a pair of designer sunglasses holding back red-dyed locks.  I could go on. Huh! I already have.

I’ve seen all of these examples on Thailovelinks.com website, probably one of the better  online dating services.  So as not to portray TLL as the only dating site or only one harboring The Three Types, there are dozens of others. Each showcases a mix of eligible girls, of which there are three types:  pay-for-play service providers; "ordinary" girls who learn how to play a number of foreigners at the same time; and a few, very few,  "ordinary" girls who might, maybe, possibly could be genuinely out to find the "one" guy. But don't hold me to that statement. Because it really, really is all about the money. And if they're on a dating site, you will very likely lose the bet if you bet against me.

Your choice will depend on what you’re looking for, of course, and which dating site.  As I said, straight pay-for-play is frequently available at the drop of an instant message. Just look for the photos I described above. Heck, they don't even have to be that risque. Now, the second type of girl is available in huge quantities. Yes, a gal has to hedge her bets, but it seems the country girls (Isaan, in particular) have MBA level skills in marketing and manipulation.

There have been hundreds, if not thousands,  of stories of guys accidentally hooking up with a Type 2 date. Several recent correspondents to Stickman (Brokenman tales, by an Englishman, Aug. 31 and Queen of Lies and Deceit, by a Canadian, Aug. 21,  2009) have told disappointing or harrowing tales about girls they've met on dating sites, Thailovelinks in one case.

That was kind of a long digression there. Back to our theme: Thailand dating site.

Many girls certainly can't  afford to have a couple of decent photos shot and buy internet time to upload a nice selection. You can see many such examples. Among the more general picture problems: out of focus, poor resolution, little or no lighting,  inappropriate makeup, poor clothing,  wrong angles, and my favourite, the girl seemingly shot from the next province with a point-and-shoot camera -- you can hardly tell the gender.  So I guess I can assume that with all of these mistakes, putting up a photo shot on a hotel bed is no more or no less than just another mistake.

I will take, any day, a picture shot in the natural light, with the girl wearing no makeup, probably in back of the farm, with rice fields flowing off into the distance. That scene tells me a lot more: there’s truth of purpose there, unlike the photos shot in the fancy digs.  As for the latter, the message is that  the girl has been auditioning other men, shall we say. And yes, they’ve been auditioning her. Fair enough.
Here are some general findings about  Thailovelinks girls:

• TLL is just one of many in an Australian company’s huge portfolio  of worldwide dating sites
• Has thousands of Thai girls as members, and a few from Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos
• Most are from impoverished provinces, especially those in northeastern Thailand, otherwise called Isaan in Thai
• Very good interface, with quick links at top of member’s page. Annoying refresh function from site that, yes, does update member situations, but sometimes mucks up multiple open tabs for the site
• Profile template as limited as other sites’ profile formats. You don’t learn much about the girl through the boilerplate profile format and, because she frequently can’t say much in English, there’s little to go by except the photo album. Many do write in Thai, and fortunately there is a superb Thai-to-English translation website
• TLL is very careful to issue warnings about scams and it repeatedly show tips such as “never send money to a stranger you’ve met over the net.” TLL is very quick to delete scam posts
• Some may like this feature about the profiles but there are a quite few "working girls" on the site. But also I think there  are some legit romance seekers however
• Regular free membership upgradable to gold and platinum for cash. You cannot read messages from interested girls unless you go to gold

This is just one person's experiences with one service, although I checked out some others. The latter  seemed especially good at pawing at your wallet and throwing  ad links in your face.

In conclusion, I found it all rather frustrating, possibly thinking an introduction website might give me some leads. I made many contacts but 98.5% of them wilted after the first exchange. My biggest downfall, other than not throwing promises at their loving feet, was that I was far away. Distance makes the heart grow cold, methinks.

I actually do have one teacher in mind for my visit in December. She, who lives in Ubon, seems to be agreeable. We'll see how it goes and whether I'll ignore all my findings above. I'll report, good or bad.

That's probably all you'll want to read this time out. Next part, I will describe my experiences with chnlove.com dating site for mainland Chinese girls.

Asian dating sites, part 2: looking in Vietnam

I had never spent a single moment on dating sites before I started visiting Southeast Asia.   I'd visited Thailand and Cambodia, starting in 2004, but it wasn't until my second visit to Vietnam in 2007 that I began exploring the online  options.

Asian dating sites part 1

Vietnam made quite an impression on me in 2006 and 2007 when I visited Hanoi and Saigon respectively. It was the whole mixture of good food, exotic locale, storied culture (think French and Chinese influence plus the  war), familiarity in my hometown with VN food and culture, now burgeoning economy, loosening of national economic reins, and the fact that, again, Vietnam was becoming a focal point for East-West "interests."  Plus, it could be  something about the beauty of slender Viet women with gorgeous long, straight black hair falling over their diaphanous ao dai.  Dream worthy.

When I returned home to Canada, I spent a lot of time keeping up with the Southeast Asian news and up popped a dating site, Vietsingle.com. What the hey! I needed something to fill those cold winter nights -- about three to four months worth. Vietsingle seemed to be very active.

Main problem was, the posters  could speak no English whatsoever. So I endeavoured to work hard at translating some messages, figuring to practise a new language. I started to write   back in Vietnamese, with help from a work colleague. That was one of the hardest things I’ve ever attempted  in terms of communication. Learned a lot but was ultimately frustrated by original messages and responses written in an emailese Vietnamese. In other words, the girls  wrote without the vital diacritical marks, making it almost impossible for me to translate. I kept trying.

I focused on girls in their homeland. But I came across a girl from my own home city, which was pretty cool, I thought. She looked dynamite. Was mid-20s, and was well spoken and thoughtful in her biography, and subsequent emails, although they were written in that emailese. But at least it was in English.

Okay, I was out of my league here, being 50-something and I knew I wasn’t going to “land her”.  But I was genuinely curious why a Vietnamese beauty, educated and well spoken, put herself on a dating site, based in Vietnam.  Call me, oh, a bit of a newbie. In February 2008,  I had a refreshing exchange with her in some emails.  She asked me for my phone number.  She said she had deleted an earlier email and asked for it again. Thing is, I had never sent her my phone number. She could have mistaked me for someone else. Who cares! I sent her my number "again." And,  dammit it, if she didn’t phone me late one night as she was driving downtown to meet some girlfriends. She later sent a following email:

How r u? I justed wanted to tell u I had a very good conversation wit u the other day. Guess wat happened? My friends ditch me. I think they went in the club and either didn't hear the fone or they were caught up wit some guys. So mad ......... I still haven't talked to them yet but wen i do.....ughhhhhhh...........they're more than toast, they're BURNT toast!
Anyways how r things going 4 u? I've been thinking a lot about going to Viet NAm this summer. It's costing a lot of money and I don't know if i can afford to go. I hear that spending money in Viet Nam nowadays is even more than spending $$$ here. I'll have to rethink about this.
I hope we get a chance to talk to u again soon. TTYL

Soon we met and had lunch, at a Korean hotplate place in the north end of town. I thought about posting one of her photos from her Vietsingle bio but I don’t have permission and it’s just as well. Her bio photos were extremely professional. She looked stunning. In her car, when she picked me up from a subway stop, I compared her with her photos. The pictures made her lustrous, exotic, beautiful and wholly unnatural, it must be said. I was a bit disappointed, even though I’d been prepared for that eventuality. She was attractive enough. No problem, really, because the personality that came through her calls and emails was appealing enough.

That was the first and last time we met. During the ride and meal, she asked a number of leading questions about me and told me she looked after her ailing mother, went to college full-time and yearned to go to Vietnam. Don’t know how she could do that with her lack of funds. Oh, I get it . . . don’t you? Okay, that’s a bit cynical but maybe not. I’d already spent enough time in Thailand and Cambodia and Vietnam to know that under the white skin of a foreigner lies the colour of money.  And here it was again. But right here at home.

So here are a few observations and tips, gleaned from experiences on Vietsingle.com:

• Almost no one wrote in English and in many cases the girls wrote in email Vietnamese: no diacritics, making it impossible for a VN language newbie to figure out their messages. Even a Viet speaking friend had trouble translating some segments for me.
• Most of the posters were younger women, 18-26, many seeking partners of similar age.
• About half the girls did not post pictures, and some used fake or celebrity photos and some were out to “draw business” -- if you know what I mean?
• The site’s interface is plain and difficult to work with, but is still useful
• There seemed to be many VN girls in the United States and Canada looking for friends or mates, which was a bit of a surprise
•  The messaging system was  awkward and dodgy
•  The site managers check and approve bio’s and photos before posting
•  You can be a regular free member or gold card member, the latter gives you more direct communication with your candidate lady
• Vietsingle has thousands of male and female members
• Viet girls are a few years behind the calculating Thai and Chinese girls who outright seek a foreigner

Let's get down to brass tacks. What guy isn't looking for the love of his life? Do you let serendipity take its course or do you get, and I hate this word, if it is one, "proactive." The latter course can take numerous forms. One of the methods is to go to dating sites. That's what I'm dealing with now and in the next installment, featuring Chinese and Thai dating sites. After reading the next one, you may come to the same conclusion as I do. Let's see . . .

Asian dating sites, part 1: looking for love in wrong places

The net result of all my time spent on Asian dating sites in two years is zero.

I say that now so you don’t need to read any further if you don’t want to. You can find some testimonials from guys who have met wonderful wives in this manner. Which makes what I’m  about to say meaningless. I salute them and there’s not one millilitre of sarcasm in this statement. I truly wish them all the happiness in the world.

I spent a considerable amount of time on three major dating sites over a period from 2007 to 2009.  I was not in the host countries while trolling the sites. I was sitting at home in Canada in the middle of some miserable winter months or simply missing being in Southeast Asia. More than anything else, I guess, I was  looking for something to occupy my time until the next trip.

But I also couldn’t sit here and dismiss these services out of hand. I had to get in there and do it. I wasn’t even what you would call motivated or seeking any kind of romantic liaison.  At times I thought I detected a sliver of hope that I might meet someone online and eventually meet her. Throughout though I kept an open mind.

I'll probably divide this lengthy report into two or three parts and I'll have some concluding remarks at the end and some links. For now . . .

Here’s what you might call an Executive Summary:

• Spent two years trolling three major dating sites and some others
• Tens of thousands of Asian women are looking for long-term relationships
• Foreigners, especially western white males, are most desirable on these sites
• Very little English is posted on these sites, with maybe Thai girls showing more and better English usage (bit of a shock, eh?)
• Some online services are very professional in their operations, e.g. Chnlove.com and Thailovelinks.com
• Vietnamese girls seek men similar in age, Chinese less so and Thai girls seemingly not caring
• If you're going to get any satisfaction, you're going to have to become a paying member at the online dating service
• Some services have  a few scam artists but they are soon ejected (watch out for Africa as a location and aggressive chatters)
• Unless you, the male seeker, are in the subject country, interest on the part of the girl will fade fast
• Unsure what Vietnamese girls want; Chinese girls want financial security; Thai girls want someone who doesn't lie and play games
• Hard to get Vietnamese translation; easy to communicate with Chinese through agency translators; loads of good online Thai translation
• Photos on every site are poor to low-moderate quality and often very misleading
• Age and weight numbers are sometimes highly suspect when you judge the girl from the photo
• And, when you do as I do, which is play hard to get and not readily play into a girl's hands, interest fades fast

That's it for this post. Soon I will detail my experiences with each of three Asian dating sites and write a conclusions sort of story. 

LINKS:

Vietsingle.com

Chnlove Club

Thailovelinks.com